The SEEK Podcast
Welcome to the SEEK Podcast – we're so glad you’re here. This podcast is a place of community, collaboration, and inspiration, created to invite and encourage you deeper into a relationship with Jesus. Join these podcasters and many others as we encounter Jesus at SEEK25, Jan 1st-5th. For more information and to register, visit seek.focus.org.
The SEEK Podcast
The Love of Truth: Logos Podcast x SEEK
What if truth wasn't just an abstract concept but a person who could transform your life? Join Deacon Max and Deacon Joseph as they explore this through the narrative of the Epiphany. They share their personal encounters with Truth in the figure of Jesus Christ and how these experiences have reshaped their lives. By examining the contrasting responses of the Magi and King Herod, they illustrate the power of an open versus a fearful heart. The Magi's journey symbolizes the courage to seek truth, while Herod's grasp on power reveals the destructiveness of fear and control.
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Welcome to the Seek 25 podcast, featuring some of our favorite podcasters recorded live at the Max Studios podcast stage during Seek 25 in Salt Lake City.
Speaker 2:What's up, guys? Welcome to another episode of Logos Podcast. This is Deacon Max. I'm Deacon Joseph, Welcome everybody.
Speaker 3:Wow, this is awesome. This is Deacon Max. I'm Deacon Joseph. Welcome everybody. Wow, this is awesome. This is awesome, dude. It's so good to see you all here. Thank you, we didn't exactly know who was going to show up, so this is pretty cool. Thanks for being here. This is so awesome. Deacon Max. Dude, how's your seat going so far?
Speaker 2:It's going well, although I'm a little uncomfortable right now because we're actually sitting and we're a stand-only kind of podcast. It's true. It's true, this is a new gig.
Speaker 3:Yeah, people who follow us know that we stand when we record our podcast, so definitely outside of our element right now, but this is great.
Speaker 2:Seek has been awesome. Y'all been enjoying Seek. How's Seek been going? God, god is so good. You know, I actually had a transformative experience in Seek of 2018 or 2019, whenever Indianapolis was and so I hope it's transformative for you all while you're here this time and it's crazy that we're up here right now. How are you doing, bro?
Speaker 3:How's your Seek? I'm good. I'm good. To sum up my Seek experience. I was a little nervous for this today, obviously, and so Deacon Max and I went to spend some time in adoration before this, and as I was getting in the elevator, I ran into some sisters of life and they're amazing and I see them and I just like feel at peace. And one of them, sister Catherine Joy, gave me a litany of trust, so I was like that's exactly what I needed right now. So I'm doing well, really happy to be here. What are we talking about today, dude? So today, today.
Speaker 2:today, we're going to be talking about the love of truth. The love of truth and we're going to relate it to tomorrow's feast day that the church celebrates, which is the epiphany.
Speaker 3:So that's it. Yeah, that's right. I mean, for those of you who listen to our podcast, you know how much we love well, beauty, goodness, but really, really, we love truth, and Deacon Max's life and my life have been totally transformed by our encounter with the truth. The truth that we believe is the person of Jesus Christ, the Logos himself. That's why our podcast is named Logos, and so we wanted to try to just share a little bit of that love with you today, through the lens of the epiphany story that we're going to be hearing about and meditating on tomorrow at mass.
Speaker 3:We figured that was pretty fitting and kind of the way we want to frame the discussion today is by thinking about these two, by thinking about these two contrasting approaches to truth that we see in the epiphany story and that we also see playing out in our world today. That's right. And the two contrasting approaches are there's the approach of King Herod, who we'll talk about and we'll hear more about tomorrow, obviously, and then there's the approach of the Magi, the three wise men who come from the East, and what we want to propose is that only if we kind of become like the Magi will we ultimately discover the truth and then be set free by it and allow our lives to be transformed by it. So that's kind of what we wanted to talk about today.
Speaker 2:That's right, I think many of us friends forget that, as Joey pointed out.
Speaker 3:I don't know how many of you?
Speaker 2:Joseph, joseph, deacon, joseph, I forgot, you went through a transition and we're here to support. That's right. And so there it is. So many of us forget, friends, that truth is not a set of principles in the Christian faith right, truth is a person. A set of principles in the Christian faith right, truth is a person. So the closer that you get to that person, the closer that you happen to get to yourself and the more that you become alive. And so, as a contrary example to that, we have in the Magi story, king Herod. King Herod, and he has what we're going to call a Herodian spirit, right, yeah, and King Herod, for those of you who know the story, what did he want to do?
Speaker 3:Well, it's interesting, right, Because I mean, we've heard the story and we'll hear it again tomorrow. But these magi show up from the east, and we'll talk about them in a minute. But King Herod hears that they're looking for the newborn king of the Jews. Right, They've been following this star at its rising and they're searching for this king. And Herod, when he's confronted with this revelation, instead of being open to it and receiving it with humility and reverence, he is threatened by it right, I'm sorry, and he tries to. He feels like it's a threat to his own power and he tries to blot it out. And then, of course, we know that we celebrated the feast of the holy innocence just on December 28th, a few days ago. And so what did Herod do in order to try to blot out this truth?
Speaker 2:He was so against truth, he hated truth so much that he could murder, that he was willing to murder anyone who stood for truth In his pursuit to kill the truth in his own heart and entering into history. He killed, he murdered. And that's the drama of a contrarian spirit towards truth, of the Herodian spirit, when we confront truth in our own lives and across the world.
Speaker 3:And it's interesting because I was thinking about this last night King Herod. Here's this guy, he's a king, he's a king over the region of Judea, right, and he ends up committing this terrible atrocity of like murdering all of these innocent children. Herod did probably not begin his life as the type of guy who was just gonna like kill a bunch of innocent children Like. Herod probably wasn't a kid thinking one day I'm gonna grow up and be a king and murder a bunch of babies. He probably didn't think that.
Speaker 3:But what happens with Herod? So Herod is pursuing some sort of good in his life, right, like he's got maybe partially good motivations. He wants power, yeah, he wants stability. Right, he sees himself as a king over this area. He thinks that he has responsibility for these people, maybe that he's in charge of establishing peace and order, and so, in his desire for power and his desire for control, he is willing to do whatever it takes to maintain that, even to the point of rationalizing okay, I just got to like get rid of this threat so that I can stay in charge, so that I can maintain my power, but then what that allows him to do is rationalize this horrible atrocity, and that's the thing, right?
Speaker 2:So all of the power structures that he considered himself to be governing were rooted ultimately in him, and this is a big part of what we're calling the Herodian spirit. It's egocentrism at its root. King Herod truly believed that he could control reality, that he was an arbiter of meaning, and this is a deep, profound, I would say possession of darkness that consumed his life and that he operated and justified enough to kill innocent children.
Speaker 3:So the question becomes that we wanted to just kind of pose, just reflect on with all of you today is like, where do we see this Herodian spirit, the spirit of King Herod, in today's world? I think we see it in some extreme examples, but I think it kind of can creep into all of our lives because it's in a real way. It's kind of like the pattern of sin that's present with all of us. So, deacon Max, let me ask you, where do you see the spirit of King Herod? Where do you see people in our society, in our culture or even in your own community behaving like King Herod did in this story of the epiphany?
Speaker 2:So, friends, we're going to draw out some pretty stark examples in history to prove our point here. One of the examples I actually want to draw on more immediately is that in 2016, the United States decided that it would legalize the marriage of same-sex unions. Over and against science, over and against history, over and against religion, over and against truth, politics and the larger society, the power structures that be thought that they could redefine the natural sacraments that is, marriage between a man and a woman and redefine it all together and to create a new truth according to its own logic, and this is one of the manifestations I think we see this Herodian spirit.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I I think that's a good example, because if we if, of course, if we read the Bible, but even if we just kind of look at reality, at the natural order as God created it, we know that marriage is a particular type of thing, right, that that truth is kind of written into the fabric of creation. Men and women fit together, they go together. That is what leads to the procreation of children and family life, and we know that that's what constitute like a flourishing human society that's founded upon that. But what happens so and this is, of course, a hot button issue, but it's illustrative of our point is that people, in their desire to have control and their desire to have power I mean think about this attempt to redefine reality according to our own preconceptions, right, according to our own desires, maybe for good reasons or like for understandable motivations, like Deacon Max, and I don't think that people who are in favor of same-sex unions or who are in same-sex unions are like evil, terrible people.
Speaker 2:They probably have good motivations, they're mixed in with, like a disordered pursuit of power or control, or happiness, or also, maybe they have a family member who struggles with this attraction and they see that that person in their family is getting maybe gossiped about, being abused, being ill-spoken about, and so their reaction is let's defend our family member, who we know, we say that we love. And so they see this law being promulgated and they think to themselves this is justified. I see how my cousin, I see how my brother or my sister, how my uncle gets treated. Of course we should do that.
Speaker 3:Right, right, so it's very understandable, but the point is that when you grasp control of reality and try to shape it according to your own ideologies, you don't end up being set free, you don't end up finding the happiness that you're looking for. Herod ends up becoming a monster who's capable of doing something that he probably never envisioned himself doing, and the same thing can happen with disordered relationships. Another example that we were thinking about is another Hobbiton issue, obviously, but like the gender ideology stuff, right, like people who have very understandable sufferings and motivations, and like they're searching for identity and truth and purpose, and they think they find it in this lifestyle. And so, because that seems safe and because they kind of have control of that, they start to shape reality in their own image rather than humbly submitting to the truth of their own being, the truth that God has created them in, and it ultimately leads not to happiness but to suffering and destruction.
Speaker 2:Another example I want to draw on again. These are stark historical and now contemporary examples. But Fulton Sheen and he was actually one of the reasons that we're talking who's? Fulton Sheen fans Fulton Sheen yeah.
Speaker 3:There we go, venerable.
Speaker 2:Fulton.
Speaker 5:Sheen incredible.
Speaker 2:Part of this today's episode was motivated by a reflection he had on tomorrow's celebration on the Epiphany. He said that one of the clearest manifestations of this Herodian spirit of recent history is actually during World War II, when the Nazi regime was in the middle of a war. Rather than submitting themselves to the truth that all people have human dignity, they were literally willing to kill millions of people. They were literally willing to silence, to blot out, to shut, to put in dark corners, in dark jail cells, in dark basements, in dark corners and dark jail cells and dark basements and dark holes. Rather than the Nazi regime accept the fact that all men are created in the image and likeness of God, they were willing to kill millions for the sake of their own ideology. And that's, I know, a dramatic historical example. But, as you pointed out rightly early, deacon Joseph, that's where we get Now. All of us in here are not going to become mass murderers, obviously that's not what we're saying.
Speaker 2:But what we are saying is that there are seeds in our own lives where we too repeat the Herodian logic where we seek to kill truth. That's in our own lives. Maybe, I don't know, maybe in your own relationship right now you're using contraception and anybody in your life who speaks out against it, or anybody in your life who calls that relationship out, you can't stand, you don't want to be around. Or maybe there's another lifestyle in your life that you know is contradictory to the way you've been raised, to the way our Lord in the gospel asks us, to the way that the church calls us to, and maybe you can't bear that truth. Maybe you want to bury it so deep down you want nothing to do with it. But here's the thing If you do that, your life will not be submitted to the Holy One.
Speaker 3:Your life will be submitted to yourself and you won't find the happiness you're looking for. That's right, I mean, that's the point, and we're not like trying to condemn people here. We're just like like we want people to experience the fullness of life that the Lord wants to give them. And one of the ways that we constantly fail, like don't attain that happiness and that fullness, is by becoming like little King Herods, who blot out the inconvenient truths that confront us every day and make ourselves like God and say I'm going to do it my way.
Speaker 3:It's like what Father Mike Schmitz was talking about in his keynote talk the other night. Like it's this we all have this natural inclination to become little King Herods and to blot out truth. I don't want to convert and change my life. I don't want to submit to what God is revealing to me as the way to live. I just want to like do my own thing because that seems safe and because that seems like it's going to make me happy.
Speaker 3:But what we want to propose is that only by living in union with the Lord and only by receiving the truth as he's laid it out to you, which often involves repentance and conversion, will you then experience the fullness of life that he wants to give you, will you then experience the fullness of life that he wants to give you? And so I think a way to illustrate this within this very same story of the epiphany, is by pointing to the example of the Magi, who are, interestingly, they're not Jews, they're not Christians, obviously, they're pagans right, they are people from the East who practice Eastern religions perhaps. But we want to point to the example of these guys to show what a proper response to truth looks like.
Speaker 2:If the other spirit is a Herodian spirit, we're going to call this one the magical spirit. That's right.
Speaker 4:Give it up everybody Come on.
Speaker 2:Thank you, thank you, I worked real hard for that one. Thank you, thank you, I worked real hard for that one. The Magi, as you pointed out, were not particularly religious people. I think in some sense maybe they were religious.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean Eastern religions. Probably. We don't know a lot of details about them.
Speaker 2:But we do know that they were sort of scientists of the time. Yeah Right, and I don't know if y'all know this story, but one of the dramatic points of the story which you'll hear tomorrow is when King Herod meets up with the Magi right, they come.
Speaker 3:They come to Jerusalem. They've been following this star, right. They've been gazing upon creation, gazing upon the heavens and allowing it to lead them. Right. They allow it to, they even give up the security of like staying at home and being safe, and they make this sacrifice of like. We think, as we humbly gaze upon the heavens with awe and like childlike wonder, that this is leading us to the truth. And even though it'd be easier to stare where we are and not change, we're actually going to set out after that. And then they arrive at King Herod's palace, right, and they meet their enemy, as it were.
Speaker 2:They have, they share, they break bread with their enemy. Here's something interesting that Deacon Joseph pointed out of the narrative. You know, king Herod wasn't uncurious, he wasn't just kind of welcoming them in. He had a desire to know the truth of the situation. I would say a thwarted vision of that truth, but he wanted to. There was something in him that was curious.
Speaker 2:And this is like us, right. A lot of us are curious to know the truth and we pursue and we walk and we meet people and we talk to people, we shake hands, we go to social parties. We do all of these things because there's something in us longing to meet the truth. But here's the thing when the Magi figure out what King Herod is trying to do, magi look to each other, as it were, and they go and they pursue authentically the very thing that's taken them to that dinner and is now taking them to meet the Christ child. And they have a very different response to the Logos, to the Christ child. When they meet him they, unlike Herod, herod sought to kill the Magi in turn, laid down gifts.
Speaker 3:First they laid down themselves. First they laid prostrate Correct. That's the detail we hear. First they laid prostrate Correct In front of the.
Speaker 2:Lord, that's the detail we hear. They laid prostrate and worshipped Worship that's a word used there. They worshipped God and then their love was so reciprocated that they had brought gifts to give to this priest, prophet and king Frankincense, myrrh and gold to this child. It's a very different spirit, friends, than egocentrism, do you understand. And they were willing to give their life, and by doing so they began to discover their own vocation. They began to see all of their life. They had studied the stars All of their life. They had been raised in academies and learned All of their life. They have been raised in academies and learned All of their life. They have studied the writings for this moment To meet the Christ child who wanted to give them their heart back. He was not against them, he was not opposed to them, as it were. He actually wanted to give them their life back. But they had to risk it all and become humble, right. They had to serve, they had to have wonder, they had to have humility. This is one of the things that you know we've talked about on our podcast, if you've listened to us before.
Speaker 2:Joseph Ratzinger says that the child is the icon of human existence. And what does a child possess. It possesses three qualities that I think the Magi possess Humility, wonder and awe. As adults, as growing adults especially many of us here probably have jobs, probably have careers. Adults as growing adults especially many of us here probably have jobs, probably have careers, and we think we know what's going on, or we've suffered, or hey look, I've worked hard for this. I'm going to go party, do my thing, hang out. I know what this is about. It's my last year I'm doing, I'm with my friends, whatever right. Our Lord asks us to be humble. We don't know everything, our life isn't our own right, and a child embodies this reality, because that reality reflects the Christ child.
Speaker 3:And this, yeah, you're exactly right, vicki Max. And this is why, like, jesus will say things in the gospels like unless you turn and become like a child, you cannot enter the kingdom of heaven. Right? Because a child is dependent, a child is humble, knows that he is not God. And this is the fundamental temptation that Satan issues to Adam and Eve in the garden, and it's again like what Father Mike Schmitz was talking about during his keynote address. In the garden, the serpent appears to Adam and Eve and he's like look, if you take this fruit and eat it, you will become like gods, you will have control and you don't have to depend. You don't have to depend, you don't have to submit and you can grasp at this power for yourself.
Speaker 3:But the magi, who I think are a great example for us, they're more like children. They were overjoyed yeah, that's right, they were overjoyed at the star. And so we can take a step back and think okay, what do the magi do? What are the things that they're teaching us that ultimately lead them to truth and an encounter with the Lord himself that we can kind of imitate in our lives? First of all, they gaze upon creation with like an awe and a wonder, as you were just talking about right. Then, after they do that, they allow it to shape them and to guide them and they're willing to change their lives, they're willing to get uncomfortable in pursuit of what is being laid out before them in the revelation of God's creation. And then this is where it gets really crazy when they get to Jerusalem.
Speaker 3:This is a great point that Pope Benedict actually makes the Magi just looking at reality that can get them so far, using their human reason and their own reasoning powers, powers that can get them to a certain point. But then, when they get to, it gets them to Jerusalem is where it gets them, which is pretty close, like you're in the vicinity of where the savior is going to be born. But then they kind of run out of steam. And what do they have to consult? They have to consult the scriptures, right, they have to go to Herod and be like look, we've been searching for the truth, but we know that we can't find it on our own. It has to come to us from above, we have to receive it from above. And so they're open to what the word of God is willing, is going to share them, show to them, and that's what eventually leads them to Bethlehem, where they find the child, where they gaze into the eyes of truth itself.
Speaker 2:Right, pope Benedict makes a point that it's interesting how Joseph was not mentioned in the story at all. He's like absent in the story for some reason, even though he's clearly there right? One of the things that you mentioned earlier that I want to draw out is in the story of the Magi and King Herod. One of the details that's mentioned kind of in passing and many of y'all have heard about this at the end of the narrative is that once they've encountered the child you know what they do they go back through another way.
Speaker 3:They don't go straight back to Herod, they go back by a different route, by a different route.
Speaker 2:Notice. This is what happens. This is what happens when we encounter truth. Who, again, is a person. Friends, If there's something in our heart that tells us that's true, that's a person. It's not a set of principles In the Catholic faith, in the Christian tradition, that's him.
Speaker 3:That's a seed of the Word, it's the Word, it's the Logos who became flesh and dwelt among us and who you've encountered every single day at Mass, in the Eucharist.
Speaker 2:And the light seeps into every crack of our heart. Another thing that Pope Benedict I was just reading earlier this morning about this is he says that when people face the truth, one of the things that the truth is similarly related to is radiance, or light right, which is light of the world, kind of the theme of Sikh right. The light breaks into every part of our life, not just what's going on now, not just the present moment. It actually breaks into our past and helps us reckon with the things that have happened to us in our lives before. So many of you have probably experienced, as you've gotten closer to our Lord, you've been to reconcile with things that have happened to you before, because that's how deep our Lord wants to enter, right. So the light enters the past. The light also enters and breaks into the present, and so you're able to see yourself clearer. But the light also shows you the future.
Speaker 2:Not all clarity. You don't see everything perfectly, but you begin to see your life is illuminated and you're able to carry the torch of the one, or I should say he carries you as the torch towards your ultimate call. And this is what truth does. It heals us, it integrates us, friends, so that when we go to Holy Mass, what do we do? We're remembered right, we're integrated, and then we're offered in unity to God, the Father. In the Mass, the particles of the bread and the wine are crumbled down, are now gathered and offered to God, in a similar way that we're all grinded down in life into the particular expressions of our life and unified into the universality of God. And this is what truth does, because this is who God is.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I guess I would. Okay, I have one thought and then I just want to give maybe food for thought for people in the audience. St Augustine, he wrote this book called the City of God. It's like a million pages. If you want to read it, give it a try. I haven't read it.
Speaker 3:It's like that thick, but the plot, the whole plot. He's describing all of history and what he's saying in this book is basically look, there are many cities in the world throughout space and time, but in and through all of them, at the end of the day, there are really just two cities. There's the city of man. The earthly, are after the same thing. They're after peace. The city of man, the earthly city, tries to acquire that peace by looking down. They're cut off from what is above, they're not open to God, they're oriented downwards and they're trying to grasp and create peace for themselves.
Speaker 3:Herod was a member of the city of man, trying to grasp after power and establish peace in his own life. The Magi were members of the city of God because they were open to what was coming to them from above and even though it required sacrifice, even though it was scary, even though they had to set out into the unknown, ultimately they found exactly what they were looking for, which is peace. And St Augustine says that the city of God and the city of man, both of those are present within all of our hearts and there's this constant tension. A lot of us are being dragged downwards by sin and concupiscence, towards the city of man, but the work of salvation. The reason Christ came is to draw us back up towards that city of God, towards that heavenly city for which we've been created, so that we can experience the peace that he wants to give us and that we're created for.
Speaker 3:And so I guess my invitation to all of you is I'm sure, I'm sure that over the course of the last four days, the Lord has been working in your heart in some capacity.
Speaker 3:Maybe he's been revealing to you some part of your life that might need to change, or maybe he's, maybe maybe you're like doing well right now and he's like inviting you deeper in, to like, maybe give me a little more time in prayer each day, or maybe spend some more time with the scriptures, whatever that is, whatever that truth is that's being spoken to your heart right now. There's two responses to it. There's the response of King Herod, of the city of man, where it's like, ah, blotted out, not right now, I'm just, I'm feeling good, I'm feeling secure, I'm feeling good where I'm at. I don't really want to change, yeah, and I'm going to try to manufacture my own happiness and my own peace as I am now. That won't work, nope, it never does. What will work is being like the Magi and surrendering to what the Lord is offering to you and even if it's scary, even if it involves the cross which spoiler alert it will.
Speaker 3:Jesus promised us that it would. It will lead to the resurrection. That's the whole point. It will lead to the resurrection, that's the whole point. It will lead to the peace, of new life and life in abundance.
Speaker 2:Our God is not a selfish God, friends. The reason that our Lord does that is because he wants to give you your life back.
Speaker 3:That's why and I know that, like, deacon Max and I both, like, neither of us wanted to be priests when we were young. Neither of us, like had any idea that this is what God was calling us to. And obviously, like, going to seminary, becoming deacons and then priests like that requires a lot of sacrifice, as does any vocation that's worth living. But, like our lives have been transformed by that, and like we've come to know the Lord more deeply, and even though we have all sorts of ways that we need to stop being like King Herod in my own heart, in your own heart, like we're convinced that this is the way, that he is the way and the truth and the life, and he's calling you, like all of you here, to himself, to be like the Magi, to search for him, to seek. It's so fitting that that's the name of the conference that joke is made every time.
Speaker 2:Come on, dude, it's great, it's good, it's good. Well, guys.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so that's what we have. That's what we have. We've got like 10 minutes left. I think Is that right. So we wanted to open it up for Q&A. There's a microphone right here.
Speaker 2:If you have a question about anything, we just said, or anything at all, if you listen to Logos Podcast and want to ask Deacon Max what his favorite color is and if no one comes up, we're just going to fill the next 10 minutes with mindless musings on whatever comes to mind.
Speaker 3:So you get to decide. And I have a lot of mindless musings on whatever comes to mind, so you get to decide.
Speaker 2:So any questions and I have a lot of mindless musings.
Speaker 3:He has many mindless musings.
Speaker 2:Oh boy, we got a question, we got it. We got it First customer, first customer.
Speaker 5:Hi, I was promised a cage match at this podcast and you came in with the WWE.
Speaker 4:Let's do it.
Speaker 5:No, my actual question is I'm curious if at the end there you talked about your unexpected call to the priesthood. Yeah, if either of you could kind of share briefly what it was that led to that answering that call.
Speaker 2:I'd say very briefly it was first the love for truth. I didn't know it, but I started reading St Augustine's book, the Confessions. He taught me how to pray. He taught me that the liturgy of the church, that the tradition of the church is something worth fighting for and worth getting to know, so that alongside adoration and fasting, those are very kind of basic Christian things. But reclaiming those really helped me discern that, like all of the other things I was doing whether it was a fraternity I was in, the music I was learning or marching with in college or whatever other artistic or degree or job I had lined up was all a desire to just actually serve our Lord in this particular way. He had made me for this. So yeah, long story bearable there it is.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and for me it was very similar. I mean, I actually, when I was 17, I had a girlfriend who was a pretty hardcore agnostic at the time and she challenged my faith. She tried to get me to doubt the Catholic faith and she succeeded. I had never had to defend it before or explain it before, and so we dated for like a year and then I was like questioning everything and then I ended up breaking up with her because I had to figure out what was true about reality, about the universe, and then so, really for the first time, I'm 18 years old and I'm like I need to start like reading and figuring this out. So, even though I've been raised Catholic, really for the first time when I was 18, I started like reading every book I could get my hand on, watching every Father Mike Schmitz video I could get my eyes on right.
Speaker 2:Shout out to Father Mike Schmitz.
Speaker 3:Thank, you, Father Mike Schmitz.
Speaker 2:For to Father Mike Schmitz. Thank you, father Mike Schmitz, for everything. I don't know if he's here. Wherever you're at, we'd love to have you on, so if anybody have any connections, let us know.
Speaker 3:But I was quickly overwhelmed by the truth and the beauty and the richness of the Catholic faith. Yeah, like Jesus Christ is real. And so I started falling in love with the Eucharist and started wanting to give my life to God, and I'd always wanted to get married. But then he, uh, he had other plans as he continued to draw me closer to himself and now I'm going to get married. Uh, yeah, okay, all right, fair enough, um real quick. Oh, we have another question. Awesome, another question.
Speaker 4:I was just wondering how you have, how you approach conversations with people, maybe friends or family, that seem to to not have such a care for what is true. Yeah, like whether that's they rely too heavily on how their emotions make them feel, and not that emotions are wrong, but you know, like along that line.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a good question. I mean, this is a very personal question. You know A few things, I guess. One of the first things I would say is I think of Edith Stein, St Teresa Benedict of the Cross.
Speaker 2:She says that empathy is not the same thing as love. Empathy is not the same thing as love, and so when we love somebody, the temptation is oftentimes well, don't say anything, just live For years. This can happen, and I think there's something true about just being yourself, living the truth. Sometimes it's enough to be present with that person, that there's something convicting about with the way you're living. So I would say be present, be their friend.
Speaker 2:You know, conversions oftentimes happen, as many, maybe some of us here today happen. Not because somebody just came up to us and started machine gunning us with truth, right, If that happened to you, you're a weirdo, Just know that. No, most of it is because there's a relationship that you had with somebody that slowly, and then slowly still, I am becoming to reckon with truth. So I'm like I don't like that truth, but I guess we'll do it. So I'll have to say be present, be friendly. And if it's a family member, right, you live that out. Right, Because oftentimes we're like well, they're the problem, they're the problem.
Speaker 2:No, well, like I have things I got to work on too. I don't know. Those are some of the advices that I've had through life myself, and sometimes you do have to have those conversations. Sometimes it doesn't have to be in front of everybody. Don't do it in a fit of rage. Don't do it in a fit of rage. Okay, Do it in a private conversation and say hey look, I've been thinking about this for a while and I want to share this with you because I love you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and if I could add something to that, um, or two things to that. It's a really good question. It's super pertinent to all of our lives. Um, the one thing is to remember that, like even King Herod was interested in the truth, right? So even somebody who's living a lifestyle that is not consistent with Catholic teaching or that you know is harming them, ultimately there is something within them, that God placed in their hearts, that knows deep, deep down, even if they're not willing to admit it, even if they're rationalizing it all these ways. So you've got that kind of on your side. It's a question of awakening that desire for truth and goodness and beauty within them, and to do that, it's like what Deacon Max said you accompany them as their friend, you love them, and then I personally love to wait until they ask a question. When they see you living your Catholic faith, they see you living the joy of loving Jesus, eventually they're going to get curious, and for me that's the moment to maybe propose a truth that is going to be palatable, at that moment when their heart's ready to open it, ready to receive it.
Speaker 3:Thank you so much for your question. Thank you Real quick. I want to give a shout out to my Columbus seminarians. Dices of Columbus. Really glad they're here. Best Dices in the country by far, bishop Fernandez, awesome.
Speaker 2:I want to give a shout out to my fans from Alabama, where y'all at Take that Columbus.
Speaker 3:Okay, we got a few more minutes, so we got a next question hey guys, Just a quick question, like what do you guys for anyone here that's a discerning vocation to the priesthood or maybe religious life do you have like any advice, like maybe a piece of advice?
Speaker 2:to kind of help them along their discernment journey. It's a great question, dude. I always heard this when I was discerning and I was like dude, whatever, like, it's the same thing, but I mean it. Pray, like. You have to pray. The liturgy is beautiful, I'm pretty trad, I love philosophy, I love all of these things, but you have to pray because those things will subside, even friendships will subside. You have to pray, you have to read the Holy Scriptures and then enter into a wholesome community. Find a local community or parish wherever, serve at the altar, talk to local priests or, if you're a woman, certainly religious life. Talk to a religious sister. Now is an opportune time to do it. Stay close to the sacraments. I would say start there.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So those are like definitely the fundamental non-negotiables if you're going to know your vocation. But on top of those things, I would say two things. First of all, act Like don't just sit around and wait for God to reveal it to you Like go visit a seminary or ask the girl on the date right, like do those things and God will speak to you, like in those experiences. And then the second thing is to pay attention to your own desires and like what you're drawn to, because if you're living a life of union with God, he's shaping your will and your heart to make you desire what he desires. So after you're in union with him, you can start to be like what do I want to do? Do I want to be a priest? Okay, like I'm going to do it, and then pay attention to how that happens. One last quote.
Speaker 2:There's a quote that was very important to me when I entered seminary. It's still important to me now. A priest said to me who was very important in my life said to me the God who made you is the God who saves you. What Joey is saying tap into the elementary loves of your heart. What is it that I love? And follow those with our Lord and he'll make it clear.
Speaker 3:Okay, we probably have. Thank you so much. We probably have time for one more question, one or two more.
Speaker 4:Hi, I was wondering if you guys could offer some practical tips on how to live a magical life like a magi?
Speaker 3:That's a great question. Okay, I would say I've got like three things off the top of my head. Um, silence, spending time in silence, allowing, uh, being more than doing, allowing, like yourself, to receive reality. Go outside, like look at creation. So many of us live like inside all the time on computers, in man-made things. Go on a hike, like spend time gazing upon reality and being moved by it. And then, thirdly, reading the scriptures daily and allowing that to like soak in your heart and your mind so that you're being formed in the truth.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I would say one of the things immerse yourself in things sacred, right? Maybe you don't like reading, maybe you don't like art, maybe you don't like sacred music, maybe these things. Maybe you don't like the liturgy, force yourself, wrestle with it a little bit. Part of the reason we don't like reading today is because we don't like sitting with ourselves, right? So sit with yourself for a little bit. So I would say, surround yourself with sacred, which forces you to do that Would be one thing. Another thing I would do is read. Read a book. I mean, read a freaking book. Okay, please, like, that's super important. And don't just start the book. Read it from the front to the end. Okay, do that, please. I would say those are a few practical things I would do, and the only way that we get the magical vision of life is through grace. It's Christ's grace that allows us to see.
Speaker 2:So that's it maybe one more, one more person.
Speaker 3:Hey, do we have time for one more?
Speaker 2:question.
Speaker 4:One more question yes, awesome hello, I love listening to Logos podcast. Thank you.
Speaker 5:I was just curious about what was your inspiration for starting the podcast and what motivates you to continue on with that mission.
Speaker 3:Okay, you talk about starting it. I'll talk about continuing on.
Speaker 2:Starting it, I wanted to give a shout out to one of my good Deacon brothers that's here, deacon Sam, please stand up. Deacon Sam, give us a shout out. So, deacon Sam, it started in a conversation between him and I at the gym, getting yoked, pushing the rock, as he likes to say, and we're like hey yo, we love YouTube, we love some of these bloggers, we like similar things, we love philosophy. How about we start a podcast? But who else would we bring on? You know, that's at least equally as intelligent as Sam not as intelligent as I am, but somewhere in the middle I was like Deacon Sam or Deacon Joey comes to mind, deacon Joseph comes to mind. So that's the way it started Simple desires.
Speaker 2:We liked philosophy, we love tech, we believe in the church's mission of new evangelization, and so we're a priest of the new millennia, of the newest millennia, and so we felt a calling to do it and we knew how to work tech a little bit. Calling to do it and we knew how to work tech a little bit, knew a little bit of the whole YouTube and audio stuff and took it off from there. We were just audio at first, then we moved to video. A little over two years ago. This will be in March. It'll be our fourth year of doing this podcast, and we've recorded every week since then, and so that's some of it now, but anyways.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and Deacon Sam shout out to him. He was on the podcast for the first two years, so if you go back and listen to our episodes, you can hear all of his wisdom. Now it's just Deacon Max and I why we continued it? Because it's been amazing to see that people, like all we're doing is talking about Jesus Christ and the Catholic faith and people want to hear it, and that's confirming our belief that, like, the human heart is made for truth and it's made for him, and we want to share that with people as much as we possibly can, and so that's kind of what's. But, and also like my, I mentioned my vocation. My faith journey was so impacted by, like Father Mike Schmitz, all these people Bishop Barron, who were doing stuff on social media and trying to evangelize, and so we figured, if God's given us those gifts and talents and we can do that, then let's do it. So we're excited about the future.
Speaker 2:And we want to give a shout-out. We're going to give one last shout-out regarding that question to Joshua Viola. Joshua Viola, where are you at? Our producer is somewhere here. He's here somewhere.
Speaker 2:There he is. He's our newest producer and so he's been helpful, so things like that keep us motivated. Then we also got Omar Camacho over here from Lux Mundi Studio, just out there talking to his friends. He's been helping us this week trip. So a team of people that have been influential to us, and we've had a lot of mentors along the way. We have not done this by ourselves. A lot of donors Some of you may be here have you given us some money and some efforts, so please seriously thank you guys for everything, and I think that's where we're going to end this podcast, but just thank you, guys, and thanking to our Lord, jesus Christ, who has enabled this project to flourish the way that it has. Dick and Joseph, any last words.
Speaker 3:No, thank you guys. So much Praise be Jesus Christ.
Speaker 1:That's right, thank you guys, thanks for listening to this episode recorded live at Seek Miss the conference, or want to relive your favorite moments? Seek Replay has you covered Access, powerful keynotes, inspiring talks and exclusive content to take your faith deeper, anytime, anywhere. Head to seekfocusorg backslash replay to download now and don't forget to join us for Seek 26. Check out seekfocusorg for more information and to register.
